FM 25 DEVELOPMENT UPDATE

[Coulthard's Jaw]

1 minute ago, Aim_Less said:

Sega's woke investment buddies money 

What  

[Aim_Less]

On 27/06/2024 at 16:50, eusebio1 said:

I am super interested in getting information on how the Unity build will affect Mac compatability. As someone playing on a rather old Intel-processor MacBook Pro with 8GB of RAM, I really want to know whether I need to start saving money to be able to play FM25 on release  

 

Unity is extremely flexible porting to all kinds of device's assuming SI didn't screw up it should run 

 

[XaW]

Ok, let's not turn this into a debate about "woke" or whatever. Any posts in that regard from now on will be removed, anyone continuing will be evicted from the thread. Message clear?

[OlivierL]

Very strange message. would weight masking not solve the weight issue ? and no more international management because it is not ready? it was not ready for many years.

I don't mind both but i don't like the delay  

[davehanson]

7 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

How about we leave out the digs and insults out of comments altogether, no matter which side you are on? We're supposed to be discussing a topic, so let us stick to that.

No problem. Just don't like being called a liar when I have not insulted anyone. Sorry.

[Aim_Less]

6 minutes ago, Haiku said:

By the way, only 5% play international mode because it hasn't been updated in at least a decade. If they had invested time and effort, people would be playing it A LOT more. 

 

Pretty much  maybe if they had releases like fm23 would be better received.

But no we got barely anything worthwhile has improvements to the point even their own blogs prior to release were just going in circles over minor tweaks 

 

[santy001]

Well worth mentioning that player weights being included are something that emerged decades ago when clubs tended to provide that information about their players. A relic from one of those points in the late 80's/90's when clubs just couldn't work out what to share about the players. If your club doesn't publish those details (and many don't) then it can be tricky to get that information and relies on either older info from a previous team who did or using the options we had in the background which allowed a more generic description. 

It's likely the game will be using that background system rather than a KG/stone value which makes sense, I don't think the ME had the physics built in for player weights to factor in with strength/balance/agility etc. Maybe I'm wrong but that would have been some incredible math to include and given extreme nuance to those attributes which had never been explained to researchers/documented for us to refer to.

News of a delay will always be disappointing. 

[wazzaflow10]

1 minute ago, HUNT3R said:

No worries. I was just being careful.

Understandable. Lot going on today. Appreciate the response. I think we have an understanding of each others views.

2 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

By the way, I don't think we've had anything official around this. Might well be a reason, or part of it, though.

No there hasn't. Official line is weight fluctuates which is definitely true. Lots of atheltes have said they lose muscle mass over the season due to inability to maintain strength and conditioning specific training programs over the season.

Think we've all been caught up in the same train of thought but another occurred to me. In order to make the match engine work they have to equate men's attributes to women's in some way. If there are restrictions around weight (unconfirmed/unsure) the same as there is regarding jumping reach and height then player weight might not be accurate to what it is in real life. So it might be that they've gone for something is computationally exact i.e. a weight of 1 is very slight and a weight of 20 is very heavy sort of thing. Keeps the developer ecosystem intact and not have to do a bunch of if then statements to refer to a bunch of other rules in a game already full of if then statements.

I think that would be harder to explain a programming decision to the masses than weight fluctuates and they could have taken a bit of a gamble on the official line. Oh well. Hopefully they'll find something that serves as a middle ground eventually.

[Polando]

Did I understand correctly? There will be one common female-male game base? After all, creating two separate ones can easily avoid the problem of weight disproportion, and currently there are no mixed games and women play in separate leagues/tournaments. I don't understand this.

[HUNT3R]

16 minutes ago, Aim_Less said:

But no we got barely anything worthwhile

With 2-3 months to go still, tbf, we still need to hear about the other modules. Scouting, transfers, the ME, the visuals, manager tendencies, decision making etc. There might be something worthwhile in there. Maybe they're building up toward release with the better news? Only time will tell.

[DMC-12]

10 minutes ago, Haiku said:

By the way, only 5% play international mode because it hasn't been updated in at least a decade. If they had invested time and effort, people would be playing it A LOT more. 

That was my take too. 

Its like the council changing a bus route so that no one can use it, then using the lack of people using it as a way to justify getting rid of it.

SI could have updated international management at any point (and missed a huge opportunity with the 2022 World Cup which was right after the game launched), but they chose not to, leaving it a bit of a mess that lots of people didn't play because so many aspects of it didn't work. Miles uses that lack of playtime as the reason for removing it, ignoring that they forced the lack of interest in the first place. 

[wazzaflow10]

3 minutes ago, Polando said:

Did I understand correctly? There will be one common female-male game base? After all, creating two separate ones can easily avoid the problem of weight disproportion, and currently there are no mixed games and women play in separate leagues/tournaments. I don't understand this.

Maintaining one game is hard enough. Don't think they want to maintain two. Anything they do to one they have to do to the other. Even in the age of git its a bit messy just to split the game that way.

[ryanlion28]

I am not going to be buying a half baked game, quite simply Football Manager with no international management is ridiculous. I look forward to FM26 as they have assured us it's going to be ready by then. But FM25 is not going in my basket

[santy001]

8 minutes ago, raverguy said:

Since when has weight not been a massive factor in being a professional footballer?? We often hear about teams criticising players returning for pre-season overweight. Of course it's a major factor when signing a player with regards to fitness & strength! Who would sign a 9 stone centre back after all? 

Height actually has a function in the game, weight pretty much does not and can be switched over to a more imprecise system. If anything that is more realistic, no one is 5'10" after a summer off, but after some pre-season training and hard work lines up for the first match of the season 6'2". You can be 16 stone after the summer off, and then following a good pre-season come in at a leaner 14 & half stone.

The game actually having a system developed for players failing to manage their weight and it impacting their fitness would be a good addition, but hasn't been in the game at any point so far. Part of me thinks a news article about Real Player X turning up to pre-season training overweight wouldn't go down the best though, have to remember a lot of changes have been made over the years because of how fragile the clubs & players involved are about things.

[RandomGuy.]

For someone who simply wants to play spreadsheet manager and watch some wee computer guys run around a football pitch for a few minutes, the way this thread is going is putting me off the game more than them no longer showing the made up weight, that has no material impact on the game, of players.

[Polando]

If the players' weight was excluded because of the problem with women's football, then this novelty was problematic from the very beginning, because it requires fiddling with the game mechanics, which makes no sense. Yes, women are biologically different from men, so what?

[Blünderbossu]

I appreciate the openness on the development direction for the game as it allows people to make informed decisions on whether they want to buy it. I think it looks like one to wait and see after release for a few months to get an extended grasp of the community feedback rather than a must-buy. There's a certain vibe given by the delay, a new engine and most of the announcements being about things they're removing. There has been a tendency to implement new features in the past for the sake of it and without them being fully realised and improved over time, but with some of the stuff getting removed the flaws have been known for ages and they should have been prioritised years ago to improve so their outright removal doesn't look great. From an immersion point of view, the loss of shouts is strange as it makes sense to me that in addition to giving tactical instructions a manager would be able to motivate their players from the dugout. International management in real life is very media-management heavy and how flat it feels in the game may be somewhat tied up with the flaws of in-game media and press conferences. A lot of people who have developed a degree of interest in women's football recently mainly follow national teams so the removal of international management at the same time as adding women's football feels like an area where this long-term project hasn't meshed together terribly well.

I don't think they needed to announce removing weight from the game. The only use case I've honestly had for it is it's included in my desperation filter for when I accidentally my entire scouting budget in lower league as along with height and previous club it allows some emergency guessing on loan youngsters and narrowing down free agents in terms of guessing what type of player they *might* be. I'd caution against taking up too much in these posts about things that won't matter for the regular user, especially if they come across as patting themselves on the back for their own progressivism where the change is either very small or where the impacts on the general user are negligible or even negative. In terms of where it can be negative, I've seen some speculation (not from the devs directly at this stage), that the questionable direction of the UI may be for accessibility reasons. To be blunt, if the UI does turn out garbage then accessibility won't be a defence - nobody wants to roll around in a dumpster even if it's wheelchair accessible.

[ForTheLoveOfTheGame]

42 minutes ago, Haiku said:

He left for EA and is joining their F1 Game team.

Damn. Didn’t know.

Such a key figure leaving in such a important stage of the development cycle for the new game must of been a bitter pill…

[forameuss]

33 minutes ago, Aim_Less said:

This is what happens when you get lazy and constantly recycle code and don't learn new skills.

Now their forced to actually code thing's from scratch to a new engine and it's clearly their struggling.

Instead of being honest about it their pulling an EA on removal of features to sell later at full price and having to justify the usage of Sega's woke investment buddies money 

It's rare you see a post that shows so clearly you've little idea of how a project like this will work. Well done.

[SHK-555]

12 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

With 2-3 months to go still, tbf, we still need to hear about the other modules. Scouting, transfers, the ME, the visuals, manager tendencies etc. There might be something worthwhile in there. Maybe they're building up toward release with the better news? Only time will tell.

Yeah that's true but it's still some what deflating that the last two updates involving announcing removing features, it doesn't help get people hyped and instill confidence that FM25 will be a smooth transition to the new engine. The only good thing is that there is more transparency 

 

[Federico]

It's not the delay - considering the huge change I'm more than happy to wait one month more to get a better product - but the continuous scrapping off of features that concerns me.

[ForTheLoveOfTheGame]

11 minutes ago, santy001 said:

Height actually has a function in the game, weight pretty much does not and can be switched over to a more imprecise system. If anything that is more realistic, no one is 5'10" after a summer off, but after some pre-season training and hard work lines up for the first match of the season 6'2". You can be 16 stone after the summer off, and then following a good pre-season come in at a leaner 14 & half stone.

The game actually having a system developed for players failing to manage their weight and it impacting their fitness would be a good addition, but hasn't been in the game at any point so far. Part of me thinks a news article about Real Player X turning up to pre-season training overweight wouldn't go down the best though, have to remember a lot of changes have been made over the years because of how fragile the clubs & players involved are about things.

A researcher downplaying the importance of weight?

Weight is such an important aspect in the real world…which is what the game tries to replicate.

Yeah, it’s not looking good.

[forameuss]

14 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

For someone who simply wants to play spreadsheet manager and watch some wee computer guys run around a football pitch for a few minutes, the way this thread is going is putting me off the game more than them no longer showing the made up weight, that has no material impact on the game, of players.

The happiest people playing FM are almost certainly the people who aren't even aware places like this exist.

[forameuss]

1 minute ago, ForTheLoveOfTheGame said:

A researcher downplaying the importance of weight?

Weight is such an important aspect in the real world…which is what the game tries to replicate.

Yeah, it’s not looking good.

Inflation is quite an important aspect of the real world, doesn't mean its reflected in the game. I'd find the word of someone who spends their spare time building the foundations of the games database on what the attributes mean rather than pithy forum posts.

[RandomGuy.]

2 minutes ago, forameuss said:

The happiest people playing FM are almost certainly the people who aren't even aware places like this exist.

It's why I rarely ever come on here once the games released. A never ending stream of complaints about things that make you notice them and ruin the experience.

[tiago_wakabayashi]

5 horas atrás, ForTheLoveOfTheGame disse:

So they’ve released another update of things they have removed.

 Removing international football from the game…wow 

removing player weights from the game…

Genuinely disappointed so far

 

I am very disappointed too. International managerment was neglected for years even with features requests being done about every year, one of the reason of the low % of people playing it. The mode received some small improvements but insignificant when we see the potential of that feature. Myself have suggested improvements, one of those ones about the "Permanent National Squad", what was more common in women's football to have a certain group of players training. This isn't anymore common due the leagues strength  but for small countries it could be interesting.  And another problem  of retiring the international managerment is that part be more important for women's football. There are more games/championships for women's national squads than men's ones. And a plus: who is managing club and national team in FM24, when to load that save in FM25 will we be allowed to play with our national squads or will this be blocked? Then what will happen with our international career? 

After reading about the weight subject, i think you could remove from women's part or make it option for both. 

5 horas atrás, Micho21 disse:

Set pieces editor was a quite good addition.

I would love it

4 horas atrás, KeegBCFC disse:

International management has been neglected for years anyway. A unique World Cup in Qatar was the perfect chance to actually do some imporvements to it but SI haven't bothered with it. It is not a loss to the game in its current state.

Really. Why didnt do it for Qatar? Now we have to wait till 2026. Sad. And i hope really that feature back in a high level how we expect. 

[ForTheLoveOfTheGame]

1 minute ago, forameuss said:

Inflation is quite an important aspect of the real world, doesn't mean its reflected in the game. I'd find the word of someone who spends their spare time building the foundations of the games database on what the attributes mean rather than pithy forum posts.

You’re just posting for the sake of posting at this point…

[santy001]

7 minutes ago, ForTheLoveOfTheGame said:

A researcher downplaying the importance of weight?

Do you think every year for FM with a new batch of youngsters coming through at Stoke I get down to Claytonwood with a set of scales and being like "look lads, I need you to get on the scales as the accuracy of the weight in your profile for FMXX depends on this"?

Take out the fact the police would probably want a word if I was approaching 16 year old lads as a full grown man, we have a weight option in the researcher tools, and we have a weight description option. I've been way more likely to use the weight description option for the majority of the time I've been doing this because Stoke don't put out information about player weights reliably. 

This is about the limit of useful information Stoke produces on its own players for browsing through for example:

[ForTheLoveOfTheGame]

1 minute ago, santy001 said:

Do you think every year for FM with a new batch of youngsters coming through at Stoke I get down to Claytonwood with a set of scales and being like "look lads, I need you to get on the scales as the accuracy of the weight in your profile for FMXX depends on this"?

Take out the fact the police would probably want a word if I was approaching 16 year old lads as a full grown man, we have a weight option in the researcher tools, and we have a weight description option. I've been way more likely to use the weight description option for the majority of the time I've been doing this because Stoke don't put out information about player weights reliably. 

This is about the limit of useful information Stoke produces on its own players for browsing through for example:

And would Stoke sign a midfielder up that weighed 100kg?

Of course they wouldn’t. Because these things are important and they are relevant. Which is why a simulation game should allow human managers the same information. 

[Clyde1998]

I can't say I'm happy about the removal of international management, even if it's for a single year. International management does need improvements (and has done for over a decade now), but even relatively simple things like introducing the same training system as club sides during the international window would be an improvement.

One thing I've clearly read differently than most people is (my emphasis below):

Quote

The challenges we’ve encountered in the development process over the last couple of months have led us to make another difficult decision around game content: international management will not be a playable mode in FM25, FM25 Console or FM25 Touch.

Coming off the back of a summer of tournament football and with this week even being an international break, we’ve looked really hard at international management in FM and determined that what we were planning to deliver wouldn’t reach our initial quality threshold.

We also considered the available game data. Only 5.6% of all FM24 PC saves have used the mode, which we feel validates our view that we need to do much, much better with the experience. That number is even smaller on Console.

Only 5.6% of all PC saves have used international management, not 5.6% of players.

When Create-a-Club was announced as being dropped in the previous update, it was worded as (again, my emphasis):

Quote

We know that this is our most popular mode away from Career and Network Career mode, with 5% of you using Create-A-Club on the platforms it's available. That said, this percentage has been steadily declining.

That suggests 5% of all people who've played FM24 used Create-a-Club.

The terminology regarding international management, to me, implies if someone has five save games in a year and one of them involves international management, they'd be counted as five total saves and one international save, not as one person out of those who've played the game who's used the international management feature.

It suggests the number of players who have used international management at some point in FM24 is a lot higher than 5.6%.

[wazzaflow10]

4 minutes ago, santy001 said:

Do you think every year for FM with a new batch of youngsters coming through at Stoke I get down to Claytonwood with a set of scales and being like "look lads, I need you to get on the scales as the accuracy of the weight in your profile for FMXX depends on this"?

Take out the fact the police would probably want a word if I was approaching 16 year old lads as a full grown man, we have a weight option in the researcher tools, and we have a weight description option. I've been way more likely to use the weight description option for the majority of the time I've been doing this because Stoke don't put out information about player weights reliably. 

This is about the limit of useful information Stoke produces on its own players for browsing through for example:

 

Its funny. American sports players are usually judged first by height then weight then skill. Doesn't matter how good you are at anything if your height doesn't start with a 6 (as in 6 feet) and your weight a 2 (as in 200 pounds) you're undersized.

Almost every player has height and weight because of the obsession with size over skill. Teams will purposely ignore how good a player is if there a someone who is a height and weight monster. Thats how you ended up with Brek Shea being hailed as a "great future prospect" for the US mens team even though he was an absolute donkey on the ball. I used to call him break **** because of how bad he was technically.

[Dagenham_Dave]

The irony of all this is, if SI had never told anyone about weight being removed, and the game was just released, I'd bet hardly a soul would even notice it was gone. 

[santy001]

8 minutes ago, ForTheLoveOfTheGame said:

And would Stoke sign a midfielder up that weighed 100kg?

Of course they wouldn’t. Because these things are important and they are relevant.

Midfielder you might be right, but in the time I've been following the club there have been a goalkeeper, defender and forward who have probably tipped 100kg. Memories of an especially large Neville Southall and Michael Rickets still live on all these years later. 

The game has descriptors in the background for players with broader frames and higher percentages of body fat. A couple of them to highlight if a player is carrying quite a bit more than just being a tad overweight.

[nunch98]

 

Well... Show me the leagues

 

[ForTheLoveOfTheGame]

7 minutes ago, santy001 said:

Midfielder you might be right, but in the time I've been following the club there have been a goalkeeper, defender and forward who have probably tipped 100kg. An especially large Neville Southall and Michael Rickets still live on all these years later. 

The game has descriptors in the background for players with broader frames and higher percentages of body fat. A couple of them to highlight if a player is carrying quite a bit more than just being a tad overweight.

Fair enough.

I’m just sad because it feels like it’s another moment where a part of the game that holds realism is being stripped away and it hurts me. 

I want the game to be as realistic as possible. It always has been up until recently. I want the game to hold as much information on players as possible - It’s what the game has always been about. But it’s being taken away bit by bit to match up with mobile gaming and it’s genuinely sad. 

Edited September 4 by ForTheLoveOfTheGame

[Lord Rowell]

4 minutes ago, nunch98 said:

 

Well... Show me the leagues

 

Yeah I remember that view of his as well. To say I was singularly unimpressed with Miles Jacobsen's attitude would be somewhat of an understatment. I thought his attitude was frankly appalling at that time
I'm glad he's changed his mind. I have much more respect for him now.

Its ok to change your mind

[Delicate Dave]

1 hour ago, davehanson said:

I’m guessing it’s slightly less than the people who have posted here who state they don’t care about international management being removed

I'm amazed at the number of people who don't have anything to contribute to the discussion except slagging off those who do.

[jimbo22]

1 hour ago, TopToffee said:

I can see why you, specifically, would think that.

You absolutely dont know me... Im all for the introduction of the womans game to FM will I even look at it one time? absolutely not, its not for me in anyway, however, I dont agree than it should be a big focus when there's many areas in the game that dont work. What were seeing is that they've focused on it as a big thing, for the last few years may I add and now were seeing features being removed because they dont work or they dont have time to fix them.

International football hasnt changed in year. Infact, id struggle to think of a change in the last decade that jumps out to me and now they use the "its only played by a low % of players"... yeah because it stinks and is boring. I know id add to that lower % if they made it in the least bit interesting and engaging. Im certain there's a huge amount of players that would be in the same boat as me.

If SI/FM wants a feature that would cause a buzz all they need to do is look towards a Director of Football role. A lot of people dont have the time to play the full game playing games every week. That feature right there is something that they could sell the game with. 

 

Edited September 4 by jimbo22

[wazzaflow10]

4 minutes ago, nunch98 said:

Well... Show me the leagues

 

Oh my heavens! Someone changed their mind after a decade. Whatever are we to do! Won't someone think of the children?!?

[santy001]

Miles was quite open about the fact that was his stance for a number of years. As a moderator it was something I feel I've pointed to in the past several times when the question was asked.

At a certain point he even explained why the change on that stance, and without wanting to misrepresent what he said it was along the lines of being positive and supportive on that front before it gets there. @nunch98 you're quoting a 2014 post on twitter. People do change their minds over time. 

The biggest barriers to including a league like the Saudi League will be licensing and research, it's not especially easy to just find people to do that. 

[vikeologist]

Just now, Dagenham_Dave said:

The irony of all this is, if SI had never told anyone about weight being removed, and the game was just released, I'd bet hardly a soul would even notice it was gone. 

TL;DR - None of this is a big problem.

I think weight disappearing has  made people consider how weight could be an exciting 'addition' to the game. It would be great if players' weight fluctuated during the season, and was an actual reason why a player has gone downhill. But that's never really been in the game, so we haven't lost anything. In fact, weight being hidden could be an opportunity for SI to develop those features over the next few years.

The blog today is disappointing, but that's just a part of life. We've known for maybe 18 months now that FM24 was going to a bit of a disappointment in terms of progression and FM25 might be problematic. But we'll still have FM24 for better or worse (and I think that the game is fundamentally sound and playable) and in just over a year's time we'll have FM26.

A scary time for SI who have to ensure that they can release a decent game this year and keep the money rolling in, but for us players, not really a big problem. Should we avoid buying in advance until we see what the game's like? It's not a big problem because all the power is in our hands.

I must admit, the part of women's' football I was most excited about for FM25 was international, especially the Olympics. It's a big blow for SI. It's a small blow for us. For a year.

If you travelled from the future and told me that SI still won't introduce international football until FM30, and it won't be any better than in FM24, sure, that would be a concern, but SI are laying the groundwork for the next 15 or so years probably, so I feel pretty chill.

Same thing with the challenge I oversee, which requires international football. Kills off the challenge for a year, so I wonder whether people will come up with new ones using women's football.

My overreaching complaint about FM (though it's not a critical one) is that the game hasn't changed enough, so now that they are changing things, I'm happy to see how it pans out over the next few years.

[Craigus89]

Last thing on the weight issue from me. It could have been masked/removed without telling us, and I can almost guarantee the majority of people wouldn’t have noticed, let alone cared. There may have been a topic made at some point with a few comments that would have slowly disappeared along with most threads. It’s purely because of the perceived ‘agenda’ that people think is going along with it that is making people mad, it tells you all you need to know. 

[Brentford Alan]

28 minutes ago, ForTheLoveOfTheGame said:

And would Stoke sign a midfielder up that weighed 100kg?

Of course they wouldn’t. Because these things are important and they are relevant. Which is why a simulation game should allow human managers the same information. 

No one in the history of this game has, if they are being honest, searched for a player to sign and set themselves the goal of that player having to be between certain weights. 

[jeru]

So SI world famous dreadful decision making strikes again -

first we remove weight attribute the exact time when implementing a modern graphics engine where the affects of that attribute become more visible as the graphical models are more advanced, smart move that

Then we remove international management at the exact time we add women’s football when the lionesses have done more for the development and popularity of the women’s game (in the UK) in the last few years than club football has. How many new players who get the game because of women’s football being added would want to play as the lionesses? I’d wager a fair few people have only ever watched international women’s football, to not have it seems a dumb decision. 
 

but hey we should be used to this sort of dreadful decision making I mean SI decided to take the replay timeline out of the match day experience because it “wasn’t realistic” at the exact time they added performance analysts and when in real life every bench now has a analysis iPad and every time a goal goes in the next frame on TV is a manger sat on the bench watching a replay of the goal. But can’t have replays in game according to SI managers can’t see replays in real life, what do they think those managers are doing watching Netflix on those tablets……………….

[Brentford Alan]

2 minutes ago, jeru said:

So SI world famous dreadful decision making strikes again -

first we remove weight attribute the exact time when implementing a modern graphics engine where the affects of that attribute become more visible as the graphical models are more advanced, smart move that

Then we remove international management at the exact time we add women’s football when the lionesses have done more for the development and popularity of the women’s game (in the UK) in the last few years than club football has. How many new players who get the game because of women’s football being added would want to play as the lionesses? I’d wager a fair few people have only ever watched international women’s football, to not have it seems a dumb decision. 
 

but hey we should be used to this sort of dreadful decision making I mean SI decided to take the replay timeline out of the match day experience because it “wasn’t realistic” at the exact time they added performance analysts and when in real life every bench now has a analysis iPad and every time a goal goes in the next frame on TV is a manger sat on the bench watching a replay of the goal. But can’t have replays in game according to SI managers can’t see replays in real life, what do they think those managers are doing watching Netflix on those tablets……………….

Weight has not been 'removed', it's now hidden. We're still setting weights or weight descriptions in the database so you'll still have chubby players, stick insects and everything inbetween when they're running about the pitch.

 

Irl managers don't know the actual weight of a potential signing until they're on the scales at their medical, the stuff clubs put on their website player profiles is usually a ball park figure at absolute best.

[Blünderbossu]

38 minutes ago, forameuss said:

Inflation is quite an important aspect of the real world, doesn't mean its reflected in the game. I'd find the word of someone who spends their spare time building the foundations of the games database on what the attributes mean rather than pithy forum posts.

I think it would be neat to notice wages/prices gradually go up in a save for inflation reasons. A super-tiny thing that you wouldn't make a fuss over or model particularly deeply, but it'd be one of those touches of environmental storytelling that'd make the gameworld feel a bit more real. Maybe my Slack-personality part-timer no-nonsense centre back could also inflate three stone over the summer due to moving job to the pie factory... alas the latest update suggests that news item is never gonna come into my inbox portal now.  

[lied90]

I'm one of the few that play with national teams, and I don't mind that they remove it for now. It's bern lackluster for a long time.

 

It's too bad that they release the game every year, sounds like the current time pressure is doing them no good.

[WelshMourinho]

3 hours ago, wazzaflow10 said:

Sure I understand that sentiment. They're managing expectations well before sales come out. They want to surprises to be good things not "I pre-ordered this game but now there's no international managment! Where's my refund!". Would you rather hear the good news first or the bad news?

The game is being re-written basically from scratch and they've had to pick core features that were high priority to get done. Unfortunately that comes at the expense of well only a small number of players use this mode so we can't justify spending time on that over something that 70% of player use. That's just how it goes for development of anything.

Its almost certainly about removing the game being a source for idiots to make comments about professional athletes weight. Almost in the same vein as no real player has negative personality traits. I just opened up the game and there's some correlation to weight and certain physical attributes but not enough in my opinion to justify its removal unless its either completely wrong in the game or is actually purely cosmetic. I'd be pretty shocked/disappointed if it was purely cosmetic for the entire game. I'd assume with few exceptions weight/height ratio is a key factor in determining the upper and lower bounds of a player's physical capabilities. They already do this for height with Jumping Reach. If height were taken away I'd have no idea if a player has hit their ceiling or improve JR. With weight gone who knows how strong or agile or balanced a player could be or where they fall in the scale of development.

Mason Mount in 2019 was 175cm and 57kg with pretty average PL prospect physicals. Knowing weight here would make you go well he's not going to be a big hulking player. It'd be better to train him in other areas because it's unlikely he'd ever develop his strength into anything more than below PL average. Knowing if a player is of slim, average, or muscular build is certainly instructive to youth development in my view. I don't use it as a top priority for transfers but its good to know if I want to add a truly physically dominant player. Its just part of the package of traits.

Managing expectations would be sprinkling the good with the bad. No one expects massive feature reveals in these updates, but it's a development update for a move to a new engine, and there is not an ounce of "this is going well guys." Miles is literally talking about cancelling his holidays and events he's had planned because of the struggles of this move. It doesn't sound good.

 

In terms of people talking about the women's weight, maybe I'm being naive but I don't think people in the fm player base would ever bother looking at the women's weight fluctuating over a season. Women are in FIFA and all I've ever seen anyone talk about in regards to that is they don't think women should be rated as highly as men in ultimate team. I'd like to think the people who play FM are more mature than fifas playerbase (or ea sports fc to give it its current name). The people we're talking about here wouldn't have known the women's weight was fluctuating in the first place, let's be honest.

[armbi]

There will not be international management, but we need to focus on woman football... Ok, take away pregame editor as well and I'm out for another year since FM 2022.

[DavutOzkan]

I'm honestly surprised out of all the bad that came out of this blog, WEIGHT of all things is the one that is being such a sticking point.