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@Zachary Whyteany news on this?

Dude, I am not going to answer in detail because I do not want to fuel this meaningless debate with you. I think your agenda has been exposed enough troughout this post, I don't need to add anything. I'm sick and tired of having to battle through all these SI "defending" bots to get a game (for which I paid good money) fixed. Good life

Ok, but if it happens one time out of fifty it is still unsatisfactory. How could it constitute a statistical proof on anything? Why are you trying to defend the indefensible. I mean, you should strive for a better game as well. Instead it looks like you just want to defend the developers at all costs (as if somebody attacked them, we just reported, again, a 2 year-old bug, without any insults or anything like that, for which we had to contribute OUR free time to find examples and report them (for free) and is still not fixed) Not as bad as I portray it? In 2030 there are only teams full of 30 years old. Try to have a look at it yourself, launch a holiday game with the DEFAULT database and share your findings. You give off the vibe of: chill SI, slow it down. I am enjoying the game, so it's not a problem if 30 other people in this post only aren't. I have found 1 newgen in the entire country of Spain that developed well, they are exhaggerating the problem. Let's wait for another 2 years to see it fixed. I mean, I understand that you like the game as it is, but why do you feel the need to say that other people that aren't are just looking for pitchforks and overstating stuff, while in reality there is indisputable evidence that the problem IS prevalent and honestly it is becoming kind of shameful that it hasn't been solved in 2 years. Anyway, I don't want to turn this post into a chaotic mess of people going after each other's ideas so let's get back to constructive feedback on the issue.

Exactly proving my point, most of these players came up in smaller teams where they had the chance to play first team since they were younger. The big problem is often present in bigger teams, where those players do not get the chance to play first team from a young age, often do not get loaned, and just get stuck in the reserves team forever until they are too old to develop. Development that does not happen in B or reserves teams. Moreover, you cannot try, again, to downplay the issue since you have witnessed 4 AI players grow and develop. The sample is insignificantly small. In order for the game to be realistic, hundreds of new players should come out in replacement to older ones, not 4 or 5. In order to evaluate the situation OBJECTIVELY we would need an excel file with the exact number of players of a certain level at the start of the game, and then something like 10 years in the future. And this study has been done, I believe in this exact post, and it proved that the amount of good players decrease over time because of the development issue. This is a scientifically valid way of studying this phenomenon, not screenshotting 4 players and saying that at the end of the day it is not that big of a deal because 4 players made it in a database of thousands. Nobody is doing any mobs of torches, we all just love playing the game and thus want to see important issues like this fixed.

Exactly, Spanish teams rarely loan their talents. And the same happens in the game as well (partially because the loaning process, is, as I said, broken). The problem is that in the game they do not develop past a certain treshold if they play in the 2nd/3rd divsion in the B team. And they never get to be good enough for the first team.

Agreed, the current status of the AI is unable do deal with the increased difficulty in developing players. They do not play their best youngsters, often they do not loan them and let them rot in the B team, and when they do offer them for loan, other AI teams don't make any offers for them. On the other side, as I said in my post in the previous page, it is completely unrealistic that players cannot develop playing in a B team. It happens all of the time in real life. In the game instead, you need to constatly loan them to a side that ideally plays in a major league in order to make the reach a first team level CA. If they play in the B team, their growth gets stuck and never gets them to be good enough to play in the 1st team. So the whole game remains in this loop of half developed players that never reach their potential. If this is the status of the AI, the previous (pre FM22) way of developing players was honstly better for the overall game.

Please if you want post you feedback on the bug tracker thread so it is easier to have a comprehensive discussion about the problem there

Exactly, but somehow I see claims that it made the game more challenging for the real player vs the AI

Dude, with all the due respect, I cannot relate to any of your claims. Seems like me and you have been playing two completely different games. You are trying to convince us that something that to everybody looks buggy and pretty much broken is somehow more complex or refined than in previous games. Honestly, it just looks broken.

Dude, ok, you are experiencing some development in some AI teams. But there have been like 30 people complaining that by 2030 teams are just filled with 30 year old players. Something I experienced as well, just need to load a new save unemployed and holiday for something like 10 years. The situation is very very bad, I am not trying to exaggerate it for no reason. If you say you saw some improvement, tell me where exactly, please. Before FM22, the AI did not make sensible decisions (loan young players etc.) but at least players grew anyway. Now, the AI still does not make sensible decisions and on top of that their players do not grow. Please, explain it to me, because I cannot understand where the improvement would be in this situation. For the human player it is even easier to outplay the AI now.

Agreed, maybe it's better to fill out the old post. That said, I do not understand your attempt to downplay a serious issue that is and will always be game breaking until solved So you are saying since before the AI could be outmanuevered, it is better now that both the AI and human player have close to zero percent probability of developing players? Not to mention that AI teams with the current status of the game are just dying at a certain point in the future so there is no need to outmanuever anything. Instead of making the AI better, they made youth development worse. Well, this certainly makes the game more balanced

There already is a post on the tracker if you guys want to add your findings to it:

I agree, the paradigm used in game for development is severely flawed. I was just telling you my understanding of how it works.

I agree, the third point of my post is probably the most important one. But I don't believe that it is because it's hard coded for B teams not to be considered legit. It just happens that the majority of B teams play in ****** leagues that do not allow players to grow beyond a certain treshold because they become too good for the league. At best B teams can play in Spanish 2nd league league, which ,because of the (wrong) way growth has been developed in game, does not allow players to develop past a certain treshold (around 130sh CA). All of this GIVEN that the player we are talking about has GODLY Ambition and Professionalism attributes. Otherwise it is simply not going to grow at all, no matter how much playing time he gets. In order to have the issue fixed, in short, player's growth should just be made quicker and simpler to achieve, without being tied so closely to how much "high level" playing time a player gets.

Agreed, I think it was just the fact that players developed their CA at a quicker rate. Which goes back to issue number 3) of the post I made above

I think this is a huge issue and in my opinion there are several reasons for this: 1) Not enough good prospects in the original database. There are really few "good" wonderkids with 160+ potential at the start of the game. Not enough to replace current star players. I always have to manually improve the PA of some to make it more realistic. However, this is by far the least concerning of the three. 2) Loan market is broken. Many AI teams do not loan their talents and let them rot in 2nd/B team forever. Even when they do offer them for loan, often nobody (other AI teams) makes a move for them. As a result, even wonderkids with good potential do not manage to reach it. 3) Player development is broken and too slow. Since FM 2022, it became too slow and difficult to grow players CA. It simply grows too slowly even under ideal conditions. If the player has below perfect Ambition and Professionalism, the CA simply does not move at all. If it plays in a B team, it does not grow beyond like 120-130. This is completely unrealistic. Many big teams, especially in Spain and Germany, develop their players trough B teams and those players DO manage to become first team regulars. This does not happen in the game. If you combine this with point number 2), it becomes a mess and you end up with a database full of 30+ years old.

I think this is a huge issue and in my opinion there are several reasons for this: 1) Not enough good prospects in the original database. There are really few "good" wonderkids with 160+ potential at the start of the game. Not enough to replace current star players. I always have to manually improve the PA of some to make it more realistic. Of the three, this is by far the less concerning. 2) Loan market is broken. Many AI teams do not loan their talents and let them rot in 2nd/B team forever. Even when they do offer them for loan, often nobody (other AI teams) makes a move for them. As a result, even wonderkids with good potential do not manage to reach it. 3) Player development is broken and too slow. Since FM 2022, it became too slow and difficult to grow players CA. It simply grows too slowly even under ideal conditions. If the player has below perfect Ambition and Professionalism, the CA simply does not move at all. If it plays in a B team, it does not grow beyond like 120-130. This is completely unrealistic. Many big teams, especially in Spain and Germany, develop their players trough B teams and those players DO manage to become first team regulars. This does not happen in the game. If you combine this with point number 2), it becomes a mess and you end up with a database full of 30+ years old. Let me know what you guys think about this.

I really do not understand how can something like this happen "by accident" and not get fixed with a major update. Incredible.

Any updates on this? Is it going to be resolved? Is it gone forever? Give us some answers please. If it was removed intentionally, it was a god awful move, let me tell you that.

I know, it seems weird to me too. Seems like a pretty simple bug to fix. Let's wait from someone from SI to answer this thread

SI confirmed it was an issue and it was under investigation, so I don't think it is by design. I mean, the whole point of this new game was AI being more tactically savvy, and they remove half the formations actually used by managers in real life. Does not make any sense.

Just updated both editor and game and the issue does not seem to be solved, which is really a shame as I thought it would be a quick fix. Can we expect it to be corrected in the near future?

Another striking example. Tuchel's Tottenham (3-4-2-1) spending 111 mln euros (!!!!) on Saint Maximin, which again, cannot fit easily at all in their system. As a result, he never played as a starter in 4 months. I uploaded the savegame containing the two examples above named "AI_buying_players_in_wrong_role_2".

I reported this issue last year. I have to say I am seeing some improvement on the AI loaning youngsters side, but it definetly still requires improvements.