Rodrigogc

I assume people take the last version as a parameter. Since FM19, I suppose, FM hasn't changed much in terms of difficulty. I haven't bought Dark Souls because I saw people saying it is hard. As much as I like hard games, I don't have time to play them the way I did 10 years ago. These factors you mentioned may help, but I think FM reviews, FM beta and good SI marketing also are a driving force for higher sales.

I don't think they intentionally dumb the game down, but they don't make any effort to keep the game interesting for those who want difficulty as well. There are some hard games that sell well, but usually easier ones sell better, because a lot of people who game are not necessarily children/teens, but people who work and have responsabilities, and they want to play the game after a tiring day of work and not have to deal with more stress. I'm not sure of this, but in the last few years FM has been increasing its sales and I feel the game is getting easier. I played FM07,08 and 13, and found the AI smarter with transfer moves, squad building, etc... Football is too subjective, so one has to understand how hard it is for SI to please newcomers and experient players, but gradually over the years we can clearly see how old players have to keep finding mods and ways to make the game harder, which I didn't see happening in old FMs. I myself stopped playing FM these days because the only way I found to encounter some challenge is to manage low level teams, which I don't like. I would like to find challenge managing Real Madrid, but unfortunately that is not possible in FM.

The main issue with tactics to me is that IRL training is deeply connected with tactics, in FM not so much so. Training in FM has only to do with improving attributes, while IRL it is the foundation of the tactics the manager wants to employ. Sometimes it takes years for a manager to implement exactly the tactic he wants, combining training with the right players. In FM you set up a quick tactic, put on the right players and you're set to win.

Yes, FM07 in terms of difficulty was spot on. Smarter AI, constantly scouting and bidding for players, balanced newgens... Nowadays I feel it is too easy to get the best wonderkids for example. Taking the St Pauli save I mentioned, I simply got to buy 2 of the best 5 wonderkids in the game (I looked the best ones in FMRTE after finishing the save), without competition and paying a reasonable price. The massive gap between human squad building and AI squad building is probably what made people look for attributeless skins to make the game challenging. To be honest, I don't remember people considering playing attributeless in FM07,08..

The game has become easier, and I think the reason is poor AI squad building and management. I've played FM07,08 and 13 in the last few weeks, and even though AI back in those days didn't adapt in-match as much as it does nowadays, matches against stronger teams were harder because they would always play their best players and were wiser on their squad building. Current AI is too stupid, you play strong teams and they simply leave great players out, spend huge amounts of money on players they won't even leave on the bench, etc.. I ported my St Pauli save in FM23 to play in FM24, and the first game against Bayern Munchen they played Wirtz as a right winger and marcos leonardo as a CM. It's frustrating.

You are correct, and I support your subscription model idea as well. Having to come up with something new every year I suppose it overwhelms the devs team since they have to come up with ideas, filter what will work and what will not, figure out a way to implement them, test them.. and at the same time find out how they can improve what has been added before and sometimes even take something out. Too many things to do within a year, which leads to countless patchs/updates, and more and more things to fix for the next year. The annual cycle creates problems but at the same time it gives a reason for customers to wait for the next version. It has become a never ending cycle.

Exactly, but that is the challenge SI has been facing in the last few years, because football has become too analytical. I play FM08, back then things like data analysts were not important, these days they are crucial and FM has to replicate that. Football these days is way more complex that before, in terms of nutrition, data, training, etc... but FM is just a game, so the point of it becoming bloated is just a reflection of how hard the task is to SI, since they have to create a realistic game but at the same time acknowledge that people have a real life to take care of. I've been playing older versions because what I care about is basically the ME and a challenging AI, and I don't have much patience with today's FM interactions, players complaining too much, loads of information on my screen, etc.. I think SI has been missing the point because they come up with new features every year, when actually I think most people would prefer that the game becomes more streamlined and they focus on fixing what really matters and made people fall in love with the franchise in the first place. No wonder many people, including me, have been playing older versions (some even prefer playing CM).

The main issue is that in real football, the likelihood you're going to lose is way bigger than that of winning. Most managers and teams IRL will simply lose, even for bigger teams winning is difficult, but FM is just a video game and players need to have that reward of winning, because if the game become as difficult as real football, it will not sell as much. One must admit that it is a hard task for SI, to adress that. That is why I think most challenges within the game are becoming too artificial, you need too much time to understand the game, but once you understand it becomes a matter of creating your own challenges because it won't be hard to win at all. Managing Real Madrid, Man City in real life is a hard task, in FM not so much.

Almost every new feature is badly implemented in FM, that has been the case for years. For FM25 they can say Set pieces and positional play will be improved, but new features will come that will be improved for FM26 and so on. In match Shouts, Data Hub, have been implemented for years and still don't work properly and need clear development. I am totally pro adding new features to the game as long as the existing ones get improved, but that hasn't been the case with FM in the last few years. No wonder the game has become bloated.

I've been playing FM08 as well, the best skin of all time and a great version in general. I started a save with generated players instead of real ones, but I'd love an update.

The fact that people are so yearning for an update says a lot about this version. Almost half a year to have the possibility of a final game that can be decently playable. I've given up already, been playing FM08 lately.

I think this was the era where midfielders were becoming all rounded, with Ballack and Gerrard probably being the best ones at the point. I remember that tactics like the 4-2-2-2 (2 DMs and 2 CMs) were the thing back then, if you had these agressive midfielders nothing could beat you.

Hojlund's Gudjohnsen's (Eidur Gudjohnsen's got 3 sons who play football, I think)

It happens frequently. City performing bad, Guardiola getting sacked... Simply because City is not a pacey team and FM is all about pace. All slow teams in FM tend to underperform, City, Juventus, Fluminense...

It's legitimate to feel this way when you devote time and energy to improve a product you like and get no response/feedback. The irony to me is that some mods here are quick to quote people telling them to post stuff they find unusual or bugs on the bug tracker, but then they will feel disappointed anyway doing so. To sum up, posting on the feedback thread = useless. Posting on the bug tracker = useless. Sometimes I feel like SI has no idea how many passionate FM fans there are out there wanting to help improve the game.

Can you elaborate more on what is bothering you ? We're almost reaching April, I decided to leave FM aside and focus on other things and just wait for FM25. I think many feel this way apparently.

So many things one has to overlook to play this game and don't be frustrated.

As a brazilian, Dutch football has always been a favorite of mine in Europe, since it was similar to Brazilian football in terms of how they valued the technical side of the game. I haven't been following the league at all, but that 2009-10 FC Twente squad had great players. I've learned that AZ has been doing a great job with the academy, but I'm not familiar with the league these days. Portugal on the other hand has been putting out the best generation of players I've seen, with the Big 3 always selling great portuguese players to the big leagues.

I don't want to be that guy, but ADO Den Haag is not that small. They have won 2 Eredvise titles in the past, but it is the same number of titles that AZ have won for instance. They were coached by Ernst Happen (one of the best coaches of the past century) and won the Dutch cup in the 60s as well. FC Twente won only one Eredvise title and it wouldn't surprise anyone if they finish 3rd in the league. The Dutch and the Portuguese leagues in FM are similar in this sense, they are hard to win as a small club but not hard to finish around 4th~7th in the league.

Yes, we all know the reason why the game has to be easy. Being easy doesn't make the game bad, but it undermines long term saves, which only a few players really play. The best way to solve this problem would be making different leves of AI, like in chess. In chess there are many levels of engine, and the best one is way better than any human on earth. You can play against it, you will lose, but you have the option. In FM we have only one level of engine, because it is probably impracticable to make many levels of engine.

I'm suggesting that playing as a team that just got promoted being a human manager sitting at 13th, while Juve (a top team) got relegated being managed by the AI just shows the big gap between Human managers and the AI. The game is not easy because things like that "never happen", it is easy because the AI is stupid and never progresses. Anyway, this discussion won't go anywhere. A constructive reply would be obvious: make the game harder, the AI more challenging. But this won't happen, and we all know the reason why. Different levels of AI would be the best way to satisfy everyone, but that won't happen as well, because of obvious reasons.

I'm not saying it never happens and I'm not even complaining about the game, just saying it is easy. The point was just to reply to your argument saying Juve is a top team in Italy to justify the guy winning 4-1, when this same top team that wins a derby 4-1 managed by a human, got relegated being managed by the AI. Of course, different saves, different outcomes, but there is a big gap between a good FM player and the AI. Like someone said earlier, FM is hard to master but once you learn what works and what doesn't work, which buttons to click and which ones to avoid, game gets easy because the AI never progresses.

13th as Sampdoria that just got promoted. Easy. Juve relegated. An effort has been obviously made to make FM cater for a broader/more casual audience. It's simply a fact. Many features, you don't have to use most of them to win. Meanwhile, artificial obstacles like players complaining for nothing, players demanding ridiculous stuff, reputation not changing the way it should - which makes for stupid stuff like the guy who won everything with Liverpool and had his players wanting to "move for a bigger club"... I keep playing the game because I like to watch the matches, but the more you delve into FM, the more ridiculous stuff you will find.

This top Juventus was relegated in my save playing as Sampdoria. So, the game is not only easy, the AI is stupid as well to accomplish a relegation as Juve.