Rodrigogc

Interesting.. could you elaborate more on that ?

That discussion is very interesting, because what makes FM so special is people can play the way they want. I'm an experienced player, been playing FM since 06, and over the years I've grown tired of winning trophies and it's been years I just play FM to carry the save on. If I win a Trophy I lose interest in the save. My best saves are the ones I don't win anything, because I keep building the squad the way I want to get my players to play the way I expect. The fun in FM to me these days is basically build a team that I like and watch the matches and see that all I planned is happening on the pitch. Which sometimes leads to frustration, because in many occasions I have ideas that the game cannot reproduce hahaha. In FM23 I had one of my best saves, managing St Pauli. Got them promoted to Bundesliga in the 1st season, and spent 9 seasons in Bundesliga without winning anything, just building a team and keeping the job. Not having pressure to win to me is vital, because I like to do things patiently and hate players and the board buzzing on my ears because I'm not meeting expectations. Regarding areas of the game, I basically play like: Teams: I don't like training low league teams, like 3rd division or below. I tend to pick a good team in 2nd division or a struggling team in 1st division, because my aim is to build the team the way I like and watch them play the way I need them to. Transfers: I usually use DoF, only buy scouted players and players I've played against and saw in a match. I'm a bit a strict on nationalities, probably due to roleplaying. Like, I like to see past squads and build teams according to traditions. For instance, if I'm managing AC Milan, I'll definetely buy Brazilian and Dutch players. Managing Basel, I'll buy Egyptian players. Managing Catania or Sampdoria, I'll buy Argentinian players... Tactics: I avoid playing tactics like 4-3-3, because I find it too easy to set it up, but if I'm struggling and need quick results, It will be my go-to tactic. After I build a team the way I want, I like to play 4-2-3-1, which is a hard tactic to master. Standard 4-4-2 and diamond 4-4-2 are tactics I like to use as well. Matches: I like watching the full match, especially when the team has been built by me, this is where I derive satisfaction from FM. Watching a full game and seeing my St Pauli playing in equal force against a Borussia or Bayern gives me a lot of pleasure, more than trophies. This is all I play FM for. But of course, I can't watch all games, so I tend to watch many games in Comprehensive and around the end of the season key highlights if I'm not fighting for anything in the league. Scouting: I like to scout nations that are not very popular in football, because you can find great youngsters for a bargain. In my St Pauli save, I found 2 wonderkids in Chile and 1 in Slovakia. Brought them straight from the source, which I find quite cool. The day I scout a player like George Weah from Liberia I'll buy myself a cake hahaha. In the end, I usually have to find reasons to keep the save alive because if it becomes easy I'll lose interest, so I tend not to buy top players, only if they are old because that is something I find cool, like when I managed AIK in FM23 and bought 42 year old Ibrahimovic. This is amazing haha. But usually I like to buy underrated players or develop youngsters. What Brighton has done in the last few years is basically how I play FM.

Only march, it's been this way for years. I don't know what I'll do if this patch does not make this game playable. FM23 last patch made it great, I hope this year will happen the same. FM the only game I play, and the current state of the game to me is unplayable. Otherwise, I'll something else to play, maybe Chess.

That is the whole point about the imbalance. I mean, I play football occasionally, attacking is way harder than defending, why is it different in the game ? Has any of the people in SI staff ever played football ? It is pretty simple, to attack you need technique, flair, composure, decision making, familiarity with the other players ... on the final third, as say Guardiola, you need the most technical and unpredictable players, because the manager can only get the players around the opponent's area, but if they can't create for themselves, there is nothing the manager can do. IRL we often see struggling teams stuffing their own penalty area with players to defend against big teams, and it is really hard to break these systems, see how hard Spain tried to break Morocco's defense in the WC but they lacked dribbling and unpredictable players, all they could do is pass the ball around without creating any chances. In FM they would have found an easy cross and goal. There is a reason why less technical players usually become defensive players, and the reason is that defending is easier than attacking, simple as that. You just need good physical condition and concentration. The highest paid footballers in the world are those who attack and score goals and provide assists, because it is not easy to break a defense in football. A football match these days lasts more than 100 minutes. We often see many goals, but we also often see 0-0 matches, 1-0... The last team in the league table can simply stuff 10 players around the penalty area and it will not be easy for a real madrid to break it, but probably they will since they have players like Vinicius Junior who has the flair to break compact defenses, but players like that are hard to find, that's why he is in Real Madrid. In FM you find a winger with good physicals and he will rule the league. I play Fulham, Adama Traore is unstoppable here. Too easy. You defend in FM and you are dead, even though it is way easier to find players with good physical and mentals to defend than it is to find technical players to attack. Isn't it a contradiction ?

Didn't know it was possible to turn it off via editor. I'll give it a try, thanks

VAR checks is just something that could be eliminated from the game. Might be realistic, but it is just one more annoying feature we have to stand and does not add anything to the playing experience at all. Since it is a computer game, it does not make mistakes like real refs. We could be spared this one.

Not only that, gegenpressing seems to work irrespective of your side capabilities to attack as well, which is bizarre because it should require very specific players to work since it exhaust players mentally and physically. The inbalance is huge, no matter how well your players defend, playing defensively you will concede and no matter how well your players attack, playing offensively you will score. It's like: To setup an offensive tactic is easy and you don't need proper players to achieve success, to setup a defensive tactic is hard and even with the proper players to play this style it won't work most of the time. The way to play FM now is: Managing big teams = press Managing mid table teams= press, you might get wins against big teams Managing weak teams = you better press or you will concede and might win some matches against stronger teams. So, always press.

Yes, it is very confusing, even experienced players struggle to understand. When I want to counter attack I usually combine Opposition instructions to trigger press and get the ball in the block and positive mentality to get my players to take risk as soon as they tackle the opponent. The Counter button is something I never use, because it instructs 7 players to throw bodies forward and it leaves too much space behind. You can even counter attack with Hold Shape, if using the OI well + right players to do the task (some players to tackle, some to pass the ball and some to run fast into space). Old Man Phil, a youtuber I follow, says he never uses the Counter button as well, and he likes solid defensive teams, so he only toggles Hold Shape and still can counter attack. FM instructions works fine, but you have to understand how to combine them and the game is very confusing in that way, new players might have a hard time trying to figure it all out, maybe that's why SI created presets that makes for easy wins. I agree that mentality meaning risk is weird, because it has become counterintuitive. You select Cautious or Defensive as mentality, and your team start passing the ball slowly, which is ideal for possession football. It became very confusing.The whole thing started after the Tactic creator was implemented to disable the exploit tactics, but I think SI made it all very confusing and can't redo it again in a better explanatory way, hence the presets. The Counter button is similar to the pressure slide, it instructs the team to do what is required is a sloppy way, press more in the TI = players leave their positions to press. Counter buttton = players leave their positions to throw themselves forward ASAP. If you want better control of your team's actions, you better use OI to press and mentality combined with the right players to counter attack. Man city for instance, they never press the opponent in a sloppy way, in FM it would mean high defensive line, high block, OI to trigger press, pressure slide in the TI probably default or less pressure, and Hold Shape button so that players never leave gaps in the formation. For new players this is all quite confusing. because intuitively if you want to press the opponent you select pressing more and an attacking mentality, and what will happen is your team will become a complete mess on the pitch, leaving gaps and space behind and conceding goals from that. In the other way, intuitively if you want to counter attack you would select a lower mentality, low block but what happens when you do this is your team becomes too passive and when players retrieve the ball they are too far away from the opponent's goal to start a counter attack, leaving time for the opposition to recompose. That's why catenaccio in FM never works, because it means defending all the time and inviting the opposition in a very passive way.

Actually Mentality these days means risk, meaning lower mentalities = less riks, higher mentality = more risk. If you set up a tactic with lower mentality and do not press, your team will become too passive and the game will punish you. I think in past FMs mentality did not mean risk at all. Now, if you want to counter attack, you can set up a mid block and perhaps lower block, but probably a mentality like positive would work better, because when you get the ball your players will take risk to counter attack. Meanwhile, to have a more possession based style, probably a mentality like cautious combined with high pressing would suit better, because your team will press up the pitch but will not take much risks with the ball due to the lower mentality. (Probably Man City would play this way). I like how tactics work these days, my problem with the ME now is that it is not balanced, like people said - and I don't like the way the center of the pitch is not well explored, sometimes players seem to ignore they could pass the ball through the middle with the occasional threaded pass, and instead they bypass certain areas of the pitch to hoof the ball or cross. I played here a couple of matches in FM13 and there is good play from the flanks but also through the middle. Quality is bad, but this is something in FM13 that is just a beauty to watch: WhatsApp Video 2024-01-28 at 16.53.39.mp4

I just downloaded FM2013 here and played a couple of matches. I'm astonished! I remember playing FM12 and FM15 a lot, but didn't remember the FM13 ME was so good. You can literally control everything, i switched playing styles within a game and watching the full match could really see them working properly. Think I'll give it a shot for a while, because the ME is basically all I care about playing FM. FM13 has got a lot of great middle pitch build up as well, with players retaining the ball instead of just hoofing it over as we often see in FM24.

But once you learn what to avoid and which buttons to click, it becomes easier. Someone said early about machine learning and that would be a great way of increasing difficulty, because FM now works as "Handicap attacking so that defense looks better", "handicap defending so that attacking looks better", etc.. there is no progressive learning for the AI, which is how football works. Guardiola is overachieving with his tiki taka and possession based football ? There comes Klopp with his gegenpressing.. FM is basically finding what works and what does not work and make your choice. The game has become like one of these movies where they have 50 characters but only 3~5 that make the whole movie go, being the characters new features that remain underdeveloped for years (data hub, shouts, some interactions, social media, training...). But now, instead of developing the existing features, they will add even more for FM25 so that there will be many things to improve for FM26 which they'll promise it will get better. There will come Women's football (I understand those who like it, but I bet most players who play the game don't care. In fact, the DB will probably become heavier).

Easier game = Disappoint experient players, pleasing newcomers More difficult game = Disappoint newcomers, pleasing experient players More realistic game = Disappoint those who don't have much time to play, pleasing those who have and want the real experience. Less realistic game = Disappoint demanding players, pleasing those who don't have much time to play. So it is a hard balance SI has to find. I myself don't have much time to play but I'm an experient player, been playing managers since CM 01/02. I of course prefer the combination of more realistic and more difficult game, but from a business point of view it might not be the best approach to follow. Given the variety of ways one can play the game, I suppose different levels of difficulty should have been added already.

One buys a full release in November, only to be able to play decently 5 months later, it's been like this for years. Is there any other game like this ?

It seems like setting up the right tactic will work with every team, given that some roles seem OP. The whole thing about GKs as AF scoring, DMs-S overachieving, CMs-At scoring many goals... do the level of the players really matter ? Because it seems like getting the right tactic + good morale and players confident = win. Not that IRL football is that different (see Girona), but people could test the same tactics using different teams in different leagues, to measure how the roles are perfoming. In FM23, managing Sparta Praga, I set up a tactic with a Inverted full back, CM-at, and on the attacking phase, had 4 ou 5 players overloading the opponent's defense, and I won all the games easily, even the derbys were easy, because the AI could not cope.

So... the mid center is the most important part of the pitch, controlling it is essential. But now, seems that FM places more emphasis on players positioning themselves there coming from their initial positions on the tactic, so if you have a Segundo volante on support duty, he will break forward and position himself on the area of the tactic where there is no players. Positional play at this version, now you can think of your tactic as "where the players will head to" instead of looking at their initial positions on the tactic, bute seems like it has become easy to break the game because all of these tactics rely on placing numerous players off the ball around the opponent's defense line, overloading it which the AI won't be able to deal with. Actually, FM23 was not different at all, with the AI not being able to deal with overloading, but now with positional play it seems like tactics without CMs will stand out because many players can position themselves in this area of the pitch, including inverted fullbacks.

Mbappe 2.0 ? hahahaha. Would you post a screenshot of this players attribute ? I'm curious since I play Fulham as well, but depending on the player level, which I assume is high, these days things like that are becoming more frequent. Agents deciding things for players + spoiled players.

These ratings cast a bit of a false impression on people who play the game, I myself don't consider them anymore. DMs for instance, I think they will get higher rating if they are the tackling type, but if you play high up the pitch type of possession like Man City, he will get a good rating only if he assist or score, from what I've watch. But if you watch the full game, if he is the possession type like Rodri, you will see him doing his job properly but the game does not consider great pass accuracy, for example, as something to add to rating scores. That's why it is important to watch the full match so that you can rate your players yourself, based on what you expect from them. I like to have participative strikers, so sometimes they won't score but they will tackle, press, link up with the midfielders, but the game not giving him a great rating doesn't mean he is underperforming. The same applies to all the positions and roles.

In fact, a lot of what happens in the game is not yet clear to many, but maybe that's something that they want people to figure out by themselves. Or maybe it is clarified in FMs Manual, which I and lots of people never read, I don't know. I'm an FM veteran and still don't understand how the hidden attributes work, so... That is when the greatness of this community comes into play.

But this is realistic as well. The way FM simulates a season is quite good actually, there are many examples in real life of great Teams getting complacent and the manager can't do anything apart from changing players and expect the new ones are hungrier to win. In Brazil it happens a lot that big teams keep players that have won trophies before and complacency is installed in a way that not even a great manager is capable of making them perform properly. Sometimes the only way out is to change half the team, which few clubs have the courage to do. The reason why Real Madrid is so successful in football is that they know how to manage this like anyone else. Sometimes they even get rid players before complacency kicks in, like selling Benzema, Casemiro, even though they were not starting to perform poorly. In Benzemas case, he was gone right after his best season. How many clubs do this ? In FM sometimes when we are winning too much, we don't pay much attention to morale, complacency, and the game takes this into consideration, stacking up bad decisions along the way (not doing anything in a winning streak is a bad decision, since you have to check players complacency) and eventually you will lose.

I agree with everything you said, the point about the competition is that people want to play a manager game, and they can't find no alternative that comes close to FM, so they buy FM. I've been playing manager games since CM 01/02, it's the only game genre that appeals to me, so if I don't buy FM, what else am I going to play ? The alternative is playing older versions, which is still FM. Competition is key. Henry Ford used to say "You can buy cars of any color, as long as it is black", because he sold the Model T only in black color and was king back then. Then came General Motors and started producing cadillacs and chevrolets and Buicks.. in many colors, took over the low price cars market and the only black color Model T by Ford was finally beaten. People adore and buy FM because it is still a good game, what everyone argues is that it could be way better.

Problem is that 1 is the consequence of 2. Sales will not decrease because there's no competition and FM is king in its field. The game is still great despite many issues, but of course competition would be great for those who love the genre.

It is not subscription, but it feels like - and an expensive one. FM is released every year, whereas you have a game like Ghost of Tsushima that costs less, is amazing and is not released every year. In fact, it was released 3 or 4 years ago. I wouldn't mind paying for updates and patches every year, as long as the game is great. Problem is we pay for a game that is released in November, and only get to play decently around March because there's always patches to fix bugs, play for 6 months and get tired because we are already waiting for the next version. And it's been like this for years.. Someone said about playing older versions and updating them yourself. How you guys do this ? Because I'm interested in doing it, but don't even know where to start from.

The problem is not only the bugs and issues, but to me the predictability of the outcomes is such a big turn off. I was playing Fulham and had built a squad I was very satisfied with, feeling like playing the game but as soon as I get to the matches I know I'll be seeing set pieces goals almost every match and the ball hitting the woodwork, and players missing easy through passes, etc.. If you play a simulator where you know what is going to happen next, this is no longer a simulator.

I got it, in fact it would be way better this way, since different options would produce different reactions. The point with FM now is that you click the same options and get the same reactions all the time, making it shallow and uninteresting. If they could find a balance between making interactions more dynamic, more life-like without it being too time consuming, it'd be great. The suggestion about firing up manager feuds is great, especially when you're managing a small/weaker team.

I guess what he is saying is that making interactions and press conferences so realistic would actually take too much time for those to play, not worth the effort. Everybody wants FM to be more realistic, but we can't forget it is just a game, and most people won't have time to spend on every interaction because it would be too time-consuming, and the show must go on, you know. As much as I like to criticize SI, it must be hard to develop a game where in one hand you want to make it realistic and stick to what a simulator is about, but in the other hand realize it is a game and people have to play at a decent pace to carry the save on, so you can't make everything realistic because it would be too time consuming.