Rodrigogc

I don't think so. Players now are more agile, orient their body better on the ball, but defensive roles have improved too much to the point that attacking players seem more inefficient. There's less space as well, which benefits non-technical players. That seems contradictory but the less space the more physical players will stand out because lack of space means their technical flaws will not appear to the viewer. The talented players are being overpowered by strong physical players now. Zidane and Riquelme said they wouldn't stand a chance in today's football. And extremely technical players have been disappearing over Haalands and Mbappes, football machines. Messis, Neymars, Zidanes, players like that are fading while we see 18 years olds running 20km a game. The goalkeepers have become too agile to the point people think free kick takers have disappeared, central defenders are as fast as many wingers these days, full backs now are creative players and build up play through the middle.. Meanwhile the attacking positions have stayed basically the same, one change or another here and there, but nothing like the defensive ones. Not to mention that players take less risk today, relying on data to make decisions. You don't see many players shooting from outside the box because chances are they will miss or goalkeeper will save, so they keep passing the ball until space is allowed. Football back in the 80s and 90s and even 2000s, players made more mistakes because they took more risk, but then we would see many beautiful individual goals we don't see often these days.

Heading 15 hahaha The only thing he could not do, his heading was actually very poor. Romario was way smaller than Ronaldo and was a far better header. Back in these days there were many players with many 20 attributes. I remember in FM06 Ibrahimovic had a lot of 19 and 20s. Insane how FM and its research has become better, even though we complain a lot.

This is what is frustrating in the game. I know many people just want to win, but as seasons go by you have to set many limitations to yourself because the AI will not push you. I play chess, the chess engines have already surpassed human comprehension of the game for decades, because the stronger engines play against themselves and keep learning from it. I mean, Kasparov - one of the greatest of all time - lost against a 1997 IBM computer. These days there are engines way stronger. If something like that could be implemented in FM it'd be amazing, but I don't know if it would be possible.

This era was filled with so many great strikers.. I wonder what FM would've been like in the late 90s~early2000s having to defend against those. I think that was the Strikers Era, I've never seen so many great strikers playing at the same time in my life. And I was born in 1975. Every national team had a great one Brazil - Ronaldo, Romario Argentina - Batistuta, Crespo Netherlands - Van Nistelrooy, Makaay England - Shearer, Owen Germany - Klose, Bierhoff Italy - Del Piero, Inzaghi Spain - Raul, Morientes France - Trezeguet, Henry Jesus, the list goes on and on...

Has anyone ever tried Messi as a False 9 role ? I'm sure it wouldn't work as much as many other roles, even though it is messi.

Yeah, it was due to hypothyroidism. In 2002 he was already above weight. Still could run but nothing compared to what he did in the 90s. This is just something that could be added to FM as well, some sort of random stuff going on with players that would impair their potential, at least it would diminish the certainty you have after buying a wonderkid. Hypothyroidism is not an injury, it's a condition so it has nothing to do with football, but affected his professional carreer significantly. So, the ultimate goal in FM when scouting would be finding a strong fast technical wonderkid who won't be affected by injuries or personality, and you would have the ultimate football player. But that should be rare.

I play Fulham and watch a lot of full matches. He makes lot of mistakes, it's not like his low attributes are useless. Running with the ball toward the sidelines, bad decisions, bad shooting, etc... But... At the end of the game he always scores with a header after a crossing or a final touch inside the box, or assist from crossing after running half the pitch. That's the problem, because in real life he is not effective. The ME can pretty much replicate his mistakes, which I often see, but in the end he's always there scoring or assisting from crossing... so basically his decision making doesn't make difference because he has physicals to "try too much". That coupled with the fact that this ME generates too many goals occasions, and you have a robot overperforming. An effective player with no physicals can have 2 chances and score or assist in one of them. Adama, due to physicals (meaning he participates all the time), will have 20 chances and score 2 and assist 1.

Hahahaha. These days youngsters think Mbappe is fast like a lightning bolt, Ronaldo was as fast between 94~98 plus with higher technique and scoring ability. I'm Brazilian so there can be some sort of bias here, but he would've become the best striker of all time had he not been seriously injured. In 2002 WC he was fat already and gave us that trophy running like he was carrying a refrigerator on his back, imagine what he would have done with his barcelona/inter speed... It's not a surprise he is the idol of most strikers that came after him, including Mbappe.

And injuries due to sprints should affect physicals a lot. Ronaldo in his prime was faster than a cannonball, his knee injuries drastically weakened his speed, but since he had it all he still got to perform at high level due to skills and technique. But his explosion had just gone, and he even got fat quickly. His case is insane, because his prime was when he was 20-21 years old, when most elite strikers reach their prime after 26. At 26 he was fat already. Owen's case was similar... Players who are extremely fast indeed should overperform, but there should a high risk with injuries as well. Very few high speed players keep their explosion for many years in a row.

Physicals having more influence is okay, but it seems like it should depend more on the player position. For instance, great DMs usually have great mentals, but those who lack the physicals should not suffer such a loss in performance due to that, in comparison with a winger who depends on physicals way more. Busquets has never been a physical player, had been for years the best DM in the world, but in FM he's always been average when playing, because the game could not simulate what he did properly. It has become too easy to sign great players in FM, because one starts seeing the obvious attributes that really matter. If you find a GK with great jumping reach, he will do well almost always. All the other positions, basically find players who are physical and that's it. Of course physicals are important for all positions, but football is more dynamic than that. There are countless examples of great players who play well at high level without being fast or strong.

Yes, the testing is a bit of a scam, but the interesting thing is that the conclusion is true. Physical attributes have a lot of CA attached to it, but the distance between them and the other attributes is to big. Teamwork receives something like 0.3CA and Acceleration 3.0. I play Fulham and Adama traore simply can sweep out the pitch without any effort even though he is playing against Premier league elite defenders, and it seems in the calculation that 3 players who've got 16 teamwork, 16 tackling, 16 anticipation, 16 positioning, 16 agression/bravery, will not be able to stop a 10 first touch, 7 decision, 19 acceleration player. You see, Dembele has got physical attributes but mentals of a child like someone said, but he overpower many defenders because what makes him unstoppable is that physicals matter to much and mentals too little on the ball, while for defenders, even though they have great mentals, they can't close space and stop dembele. The imbalance that makes Dembele's poor mentals not matter much, also is what makes defenders great mentals not enough to stop him.

It seems to me that attributes have become obsolete in FM. Not that they don't matter, but they have become just one of the variables that influence the quality of the player. FM has become too complex, they kept adding new features and now morale, interactions, dynamics, training, happiness, fitness, all of these influence too much on players performance. Morale may be the most influentional, if a player is happy he will perform (which is realistic actually), but attributes have been lost in all of these. Somebody mentioned making variable attributes, where 17 pace in croatian league wouldn't mean 17 pace in Premier league, and I think it sounds like a good approach. Or even hide attributes and put them in a pack where they will be shown within some range that you will have to figure out as you train the player.

Yes, I've seen many tests regarding this. A guy promoted with Southampton bought only high acceleration and pace players and finished in 7th his first Premier league season after getting promoted. On the other hand, many teams that don't have fast players underperform, like Juventus and Fluminense (Brazil). It is just obvious how physical attributes have so much impact. I manage Adama Traore, he is only a fast player and has been racking up goals in Premier league with very low technical and mental attributes. As for defenders, it seems like not even Tackling and marking are important anymore, since they will be passive anyway.

I noticed that with the AI managers as well. In my Fulham save Pep was sacked and Juventus got relegated in the first season. I haven't checked their system, but even without checking I'm sure they were playing a cautious system given their players suit it better. Relegated. I think there are countless examples of how attacking systems will overpower others no matter what. And defending in football should be easier than attacking, just in case.

I would love to be FM'ed as many times as possible.

Why can't the AI deal with overload ? I'm asking because I really don't know and I've seen it in FM23 as well in the tactics I created. That's not to say these tactics don't work, but most of them will stop working as soon as there is another update to the game - That's excellent news !

That would be a great idea! Makes way more sense indeed. Guardiola likes to play 433 but at Bayern he played many different tactical styles, even 343 with fullbacks as centerbacks. I think it would be nice if managers had a certain preferred style, and then they would use formations that suited that style. Klopp = pressing = 4231, 433.. Guardiola = Possession = 433, 343.. Conte = counter = 352, 4141... Curiously, all the managers you've cited are italians, where defending with 3 at the back is common.

I think most managers don't even have a prefered formation. Modern football requires flexibility, having a prefered formation is suicide.

You can make the game harder but you can't make AI better, that's the problem. Even though one can create a set of restrictions to keep the game challenging, AI is still dumb anyway. Bad at squad building, bad at substitutions, bad at tactics... Many people play attributeless and that is challenging, but still won't make AI any better. Football is like: A manager is doing well ? Certain style of football is prevailing ? Someone will come up with a way to counter it. In FM that does not happen, AI is flat as you keep progressing. Implementing some sort of machine learning in FM would be a way, but that seems impossible.

What I just saw in your tactic is exactly attacking team (positve mentality combined with the TIs you gave is attacking anyway), high tempo (slightly higher tempo is high tempo anyway), pressing (higher defensive line, step up more, more often is pressing anyway), 2 mezzalas (exactly what we've been discussing). Your tactic is basically what people are complaining about, the type of tactic that the AI won't be able to stop. The fact that you lost 1 game the whole season says it all.

It is absolute insanity that center midfield is not more important than other zones in the field. Teams in football always try to attack through the center by default, that is why the opposition always congest this zone. Attacking wide zones serves the purpose to open space in the center zones. This is basic football. I mean, look at all the great teams in 21th century football. You won't see bad midfielders, you will see the best ones, because they will control the center, hence controlling the game. Milan with pirlo seedorf kaka, Real madrid with casemiro kroos modric, Barcelona with busquets xavi iniesta.. The fact that you can use roles where players will burst forward with no regard to initial position should be easily exploited by the AI. Teams like that will leave space in the whole center midfield, any basic coach will be able to exploit it. Space in the center is all that players look for. Somebody should try out a tactic like that, I doubt it won't work given the state of the game. I just made it up for fun.

I remember couple of years ago the Ball winning midfielder with the run forward instruction was massively OP, so they locked it and have been doing the same for other roles as well. Seems like an attempt to prevent people finding ways to break the ME. The problem is that all these restrictions make the game very flat. I get pissed with the lack of freedom to customize my PIs as well. Lampard at Chelsea was a playmaker and scored a lot of goals as well, shooting from outside the box and running into the box. How am I gonna make a AP score goals if I can't tell him to shoot more ? Football is too subjective, in my opinion SI should allow more freedom and if people find a way to break the engine, that's their problem. Because if you have to create a lot of restrictions to prevent diablo tactics and all, you will restrict players who like to explore the game and create their own way of enjoying football.

- 1st one: Must be the reason why pressing is so effective. Some sort of compensation, since possession in defence is weak, pressing will be OP. -2nd one: Must be the reason why tactics with CM-at and Mezzala-at work so much. You abandon the midfield and attack the area. If you have more attackers on the final third than the opposition defence, you will score. This was a problem in FM23 as well. What is even more bizarre to me is that football work the other way around actually. In any sport you first try to control the midfield, even in chess works this way. In FM this logic does not apply, which is illogical. I watch a lot of full matches, and I simply don't understand why the tip of the opposition area is almost bypassed when you're in possession. Players simply hoof the ball or play wide. You can see space there from your screen, but the players in the pitch can't. The space seems tighter to them than it truly is. In the central midfield, opposition cast a bigger shadow than they should, in the wide areas of the pitch, opposition cast no shadow at all. Sometimes Wing backs and wingers simply go on carrying the ball without any obstacle and cross the ball easily.

Isn't that how Bayern Munich plays with tuchel this season ? I'm not watching their games at all, but I saw people discussing how their DMs are not working togheter, etc.. yet in FM this tactic would steamroll Bundesliga with a squad as Bayern's. Their are getting the results, but 1st is Bayer Leverkusen play way more efficient football. What I feel is that wing play is OP. I play Fulham with Palhinha as my Central Defender, my fullbacks are actually Central defenders, and one of them, Adarabioyo, is assisting more than my midfielders. Bizarre.

I haven't read the whole thread, so ignore if this has been adressed already: Do you guys take into consideration that players might be being used in an underperforming role by the AI ? For instance, this: Dribbles Made - a good indicator for Advanced Playmaker; Indeed that is correct, but what if a player who's got good dribbling is being used in a role where he won't dribble at all ? How do you know he is good at it ? The AI often misuses players, playing St Pauli I've seen bayern using Wirtz as a winger, Marcos Leonardo in my save was being used as a CM even though he is a striker.. I've played attributeless for a while and adored it, but turned on attributes again because I didn't know how to evaluate my own newgens. Would like to play attributeless again though.